Good morning. After reading responses to yesterday’s match from various sources and listening to a few podcasts, I noticed a theme popping up: Jorginho was to blame for Arsenal’s final two goals. When I heard this, I felt vindicated. I’ve been on record for years that I think he’s a fantastic passer of the ball but an atrocious defender*. When the rumors dropped that Arsenal were after him I had a freak out on Twitter and proclaimed that if we play him, he will cost us points. His one-v-one duels while at Chelsea were legendarily bad and I always marveled at how he got away with late tackles and bad defending without getting sent off (he has two career red cards, both 2nd yellows). He reminds me a lot of a smaller version of Xhaka but one who gets away with the bad stuff.
That’s not to say that I have some great insight into Jorginho but rather to say that I’m biased against the player. So, I eagerly went to the video to find the damning evidence that the Italzialan was the culprit.
Before I look at the accusations let’s remember Jorginho made a goal-line clearance in the 68th minute which saved us a goal (or at least an offside review) so he wasn’t entirely running around like a headless chicken as I’ve seen people suggest. He also smartly used a professional foul in the first half to block off a counter attack and he didn’t get a yellow, which I thought was funny.
And also, as an aside, in rewatching the game I was reminded of the Haaland penalty. Haaland wasn’t awarded the penalty but watching it again I’m reminded that Haaland grabs Gabriel’s shoulder and hauls him back, that’s how Haaland gets in front of Gabriel. And on the way toward the ball, Haaland gives an extra shove which sends Gabriel to the ground, causes Gabriel to touch Haaland’s foot, which he then uses as an excuse to fall over. Lee Dixon insists that it’s a pen because “Haaland got in front” it’s always going to be a pen he says. I’m not so sure. It feels like one of those ones where the attacking player fouls the defender in order to get an advantage. I think a different referee might have seen that and decided a foul against Haaland because it’s the only way he gets in front of Gabriel.
On to the meat.
For City’s 2nd goal, it’s the 70th minute and Arsenal are trying to play out the back. Jorginho makes a ton of great runs to get himself open to receive the ball, finally collects, makes a nice pass upfield, bypassing most of City’s players. There’s a nice little cross to Xhaka wide open, he goes to play in a ball to Nketiah and it’s frankly an awful pass straight out of play.
City kick it long (after some sort of delay) and Saliba deftly heads the ball away from Haaland (who is pulling and grappling him). Xhaka wins the second ball and takes it toward the sideline but doesn’t know what to do with it. He’s looking around, Zinny isn’t showing for him in space, so he just plays a baby-shit soft pass right to Rodri. Rodri passes back to Ederson, we put on a half press and they break it by passing back to where Xhaka just was, Walker heads it to de Bruyne, Xhaka turns to watch the play develop – he’s got the best seat in the house.
De Bruyne heads it to Bernardo but crucially here Gabriel had come barrelling out to close space on de Bruyne. The set up doesn’t look too bad, though. We have a numerical advantage.
Zinny cuts out Nard dog’s attempted nutmeg and Gabriel collects. Danger should be over. Gabriel, however, instead of passing back to Ramsdale with the simplest of passes or kicking the ball out of play, elects to try some kind of – I don’t even know what to call it – pass to I don’t know who. This was the point where I thought that Arsenal looked shell shocked. We’d just had three incredibly bad, nervous-looking, moments of play in a row all down the same side of the pitch.
Bernardo gets the ball and at this point, yes, Jorginho is “out of position” but I’m not sure what people are expecting him to have done? You can’t expect your teammate to have a mental collapse the way Gabriel just did and gift the ball to them in that position. He does see the danger, however, and does try to get himself in some sort of position but there’s not much he or anyone could do. He is caught here guarding both Haaland and the ball. He does hesitate the instant before Bernardo plays Haaland and the suggestion is that Partey would have read that better and frankly I think that’s magical thinking. I’ve seen Partey caught in that same position many times.
But moreover, there were still two more passes before Grealish scores. And Grealish’s shot was deflected by Tomiyasu’s block which is why Ramsdale didn’t save it. I mean, look, I don’t like Jorginho and I see him as a liability but this goal is not down to Jorginho. This is a total team failure starting with Gabriel’s insane pass and ending with a bit of a lucky goal by Grealish.
I need to point out that after that goal there were four more nervous moments with Gabriel. He looks completely gone at this point: there’s a long ball he misjudges that Zinny heads back to Ramsdale, he follows that up with a weird pass (while he’s under no pressure) to Martinelli putting the ball in pressure, Nelli passes it back to Gabriel, and then he tries an incredibly dangerous pass to Xhaka which is blocked by Bernardo. Thankfully Jorginho was there to stop the insanity, collect the ball, and make a calm pass to kill off what could have been another goal.
A few minutes later, for the third goal, once again City hit it long to Haaland. He flicks on but Saliba plays it back to Ramsdale. It’s clear on the second viewing that the whole tactic here from City is to bypass Arsenal’s midfield and get the ball high to put pressure on Arsenal’s defenders, especially it seems, Gabriel. The ball is pinged around a bit by Arsenal, goes to Gabriel, he tries another audacious pass up the pitch – to Trossard, who is bundled off the ball by Walker Texas Ranger. Rodri picks up the ball and Xhaka gives some pressure. At this point, however, Jorginho is left covering Erling Braut Haaland (scorer of 30+ goals this season) and also Ilkay Gundogan. Does it sound or look familiar to you? It should, it’s the same problem Arsenal had on the 2nd goal.
Saliba, for me, is the problem here. For both of the goals the space between Saliba and Gabriel is incredibly bad and it looks like the CBs are trying to stay away from Haaland. The screen cap at 81:01 shows the problem clearly: Saliba is in no man’s land. Xhaka closes on Rodri, and you can see Jorginho wants to close on Gundogan, but he can’t because that would have left Haaland wide open (which would have been criminal because Rodri clips in an easy ball for an easy goal and then Jorginho DOES get the blame). It all hinges on one problem, if Saliba closes down on Haaland then that attack is much easier to defend.
But he doesn’t and instead, Jorginho is left covering two players, he shades Haaland and then closes down on Gundogan when Rodri makes the simple pass. That leaves Haaland open. Saliba, meanwhile, stands still.
To Jorginho’s credit, Gundogan doesn’t “go past him too easily” as I heard someone say on the Totally Football Show. He actually doesn’t get past Jorginho at all (he slips and almost falls over). Blaming Jorginho for the third goal, is in my opinion, absurd. In fact, I can’t find any reason to blame him for any of the goals. I know that he’s a former Chelsea man and I also don’t like him but I think our own players were the ones who need calumny here, not the Italzilian.
I’m not the biggest Jorginho fan and when I heard that a lot of people blamed him for the last two goals I went to the video excited to see just how badly he did, in order to confirm my bias. The video did the exact opposite.
This was, as I wrote in my piece yesterday, a team collapse. A lot of experienced players like Xhaka and Gabriel made a lot of really bad plays in the final 20 minutes of the match. Gabriel is probably to blame for the 2nd goal and Saliba (who was good for most of the match) fell completely asleep and handed off two players to Jorginho for the third goal.
I’m sure Jorginho will make mistakes for Arsenal and be clearly to blame for a defeat. You’re just going to have to save that scapegoating for another game, I’m afraid.
*I wrote a post about it in 2020 when Arsenal were first looking at him. I said: “Jorge and Granit aren’t the most mobile defenders. Both have been played as the “Pirlo” dictating play from the deep lying midfield role (often confused for DM) and both have been subsequently exposed for their defensive frailties.”
He’s slow and he played for Chelsea but….give him a break – he always shows for the ball, he’s confident on it, and he keeps play moving. I think Partey’s much more dynamic defensively and offensively but Jorgi boy will be a useful deputy, both in the PL, as on Wednesday, and particularly in the Europa.
He was fine. It’s possible things would have been a little better in the second half with Partey. The defense is more used to having him there as a key figure in playing out from the back. But you can’t really blame Jorghino for not having the same amount of time with the team.
And honestly, I don’t really ascribe much blame to anyone on the 3rd goal. We weren’t awful on that one, it was a goal scored by a good team, with a top striker. The sort of goal that City will score sometimes, and the sort of goal I think we score sometimes.
wow, i didn’t know anyone else was talking about it. likewise, i didn’t imply that jorginho was totally at fault for the result; just that he had a role in those goals that no one was talking about. i declared the reason arsenal lost was the changes guardiola made in the second half when he moved bernardo silva to midfield.
in football, you have to continually make judgement calls. the best call is nearly always subjective, especially in the moment. what’s not subjective is if jorginho is going to rotate away from haaland, he has to deny the entry ball to haaland, or at least delay the pass or make it more difficult. both entry balls to haaland were easy passes that jorginho could have prevented.
on the first goal, jorginho’s rotation compromised the balance of the team. there are plenty of bodies already around the ball. unless a dribbler is collapsing the defense, he doesn’t need to go over there, too. but he did and this rotation made it a 3v2 with grealish unmarked at the back post; easy goal.
for the second goal, gabriel is at the touchline while jorginho is clearly the closest to haaland. as gabriel is transitioning centrally, jorginho gesticulates with his hands but doesn’t actually communicate with gabriel. as a result, coupled with the changing situation on the field, both arsenal players rotate away from haaland.
could saliba and tomiyasu have come closer to the ball? yes. however, that’s not how they’ve typically done under arteta. mostly, he employ a system that either inverts the offside fullback to midfield or drops the cdm between the two center backs if they get stretched like that. as a coach, i don’t strategize that way but i understand the concept. if jorginho drops in, maybe it’s a 1-1 draw.
i think my difference are philosophical. first, you have to know what the situation is and then you develop it. if you fail to understand or respect the situation, you’re gonna lose. if you fail to develop the situation, you’re gonna lose. unless you’re an idiot, the situation dictates everything.
second, communication must be effective. the gesticulation jorginho did that was neither seen nor acknowledged by his native countryman is called a failure to communicate. as a coach, a pet peeve of mine is yelling the name of the player with the ball. it’s the most stupid thing i know of but go to any park and that’s the main thing you here. josh! josh! josh! why the heck are you yelling my name? i need info. man on. turn. drop. swing. line. carry. with speed. a variation of short, concise, 2-3 syllable communique that are specific and effective. on the contrary, if you’re talking to someone who does not have the ball, the first thing you do is say their name…..followed by a 2 to 3-syllable utterance that is as equally informative. tim, slide left. tim, overlap. tim, drop. tim, step hard. tim, bring him wide. etc. in training, we practice saying it and hearing it, like it’s a new language. you’re sharing/receiving information with your team and there’s zero ambiguity as a name was explicitly announced before the directive.
like i said, these are likely philosophical things with me and when they’re not employed, i just find it weird.
I don’t know how you can straight up absolve Gabriel of responsibility for his duff pass, and somehow manage to insinuate that Jorginho put him off by gesticulating.
Gabriel cant see Jorgingo because KDB has cut off the passing lane, and come across to press. Bernardo is almost in the passing lane to Xhaka. That’s a very high risk pass to attempt. Any reasonable look at G6’s options sees a check back and a right footed, angled back pass to Ramsdale… or a safety first kick out of touch. What do you mean he’s “transitioning centrally?” That’s footy speak for what, exactly?
Haaland become active after Gabriel’s mistake, and suddenly, with Gabriel and Xhaka out of the picture, it’s KDB, Bernardo and Haaland running at the Arsenal defence with other city runners from midfield. That’s an overload on the whole defence, not just Jorginho. Who — deciding in a split second — does he pick up? Silva, KDB and Gundogan all have goal scoring ability from open play and in transition.
What the turnover did was to create an attacking overload in transition, and City were clinical and streetwise enough to punish our mistake.
Look, the experience of Willian and Cech made me a mite skeptical about Jorginho, but I thought that the lad acquitted himself well, on a day that several other of our leading players wilted. I’ve never see Ode — the Arsenal player I most enjoy watching currently — so ball-insecure and nervous.
whoa, slow down claudeivan. first, i haven’t absolved gabriel of anything. second, my point about jorginho “gesticulating” was about his failure to communicate his thoughts to gabriel. we can look at the video and see what jorginho was thinking but gabriel didn’t see what we did as he wasn’t looking at jorginho. this happens all the time at every level of the game and something i deliberately address when coaching. that’s what my communication soliloquy was all about. you have to communicate your thoughts effectively.
the most critical moment in any game is universally recognized as the transition, particularly when you go from being in possession to losing possession. it’s part of the game and happens to everyone. you’re not postured to defend and are most vulnerable. also, when i said gabriel was “transitioning centrally”, i meant he was out wide when arsenal lost the ball and he was transitioning to his normal central defensive posture.
the overload is why i say he should have stayed central. if the defense had collapsed, then he needed to do something. in the end, i never said he had a bad game or was the reason arsenal lost. pep out-coached arteta is the reason arsenal lost. as for today, i thought jorginho was excellent. he looked hungry and eager to win today. loved seeing that.
The solution has to be more directness from our interiors. When they double up our wide, pop, run into the inside channel. When they try to get tight, knock it past them and you’re in.
Ode doesn’t make enough of those types of runs. He loves to show for the ball to feet and he’s so good at that but it becomes predictable. Xhaka does make those runs but with his foot speed they barely have to honor it. The only time he’s dangerous is those inswinger crosses he puts in off his left.
The other thing is ball carrying from midfield. Ode is a pass first player who can dribble but doesn’t seem to want to do it. What makes KdB so special is he can put the ball anywhere but he can also blow by your midfield. Players who can do both are rare. At least one of our interiors needs to be a ball carrier and direct runner. ESR is the prototype, but he hasn’t played that role before and would need tuning up physically and defensively.
Ode can be coached to dribble more aggressively and make 2nd man runs just like he could be coached to shoot more. I think that’s the next stage of his evolution. Xhaka cannot be coached to be quicker or to dribble and he has already peaked physically. When he is out of form like this it’s painful to watch. Arteta loves him but needs to be brave here: Xhaka is killing our offensive flow right now.
The internal solution would be to put Zinchenko in the left interior role and play Tierney at LB. Zinny has the burst to go past people, and he is obviously amazing technically as well. We would lose something without him in the deeper role he’s been playing but Tierney can do a lot of that too. At this moment in time it’s the obvious move to liven up this attack.
Not to toot my own horn too much here but… I will toot my own horn a bit. So Arteta doesn’t make the more radical move I suggested. But it’s clear they emphasized those underlapping runs from the interiors. In the first 3 minutes, the Arsenal interiors made 3 of those. Nothing came of them, but seeing how they were conceding easy penalty box entries, Villa had to adjust and their center mids started tracking those underlaps. That in turn opened up space for the wingers to come inside and deliver crosses and combine with the midfielders. Arsenal looked like Arsenal again.
Jorginho is so far down the list of problems… our backup stopgap 6 is not athletic enough? Sure. First world problems and all that. He’s gonna be just fine.
Bigger issues abound, namely how to solve the offensive logjam that teams are putting us into ever since Newcastle, and how to stop conceding from set pieces and second balls from punts. Short answer to both: move Zinchenko to Xhaka’s position and play Kieran Tierney at LB.
Guardiola went for zlatan at barca, and for haalland at city. Seems to me that that’s the solution when your team is dominating possession but opponents are all set up to low block and play for a point.
I say it’s time for Tomi to evolve into our hammer lol
Zlatan is an elite #10 in a giant’s body and Haaland is an elite sprinter in a giant’s body (top speed equal to Mudryk and tied for best in Europe). They are both freaks of nature.
We were naive on Wednesday. Simple as that.
I agree we need to get back to speed and directness. Today’s the day. Let’s trade a little control for more “fast break” chances.
We need to convince ourselves that we are not paper tigers. We need to generate unbelievable belief (as Merson once said). Starting today.
JOOOORRRGGGHHHIIIIIIIIIIIIINHHHHHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
Lol. Don’t think many would have scripted that ending, but I’ll definitely take it. Hopefully a marker for the rest of the season.
Maupay’s kick finally came full circle to benefit the Arsenal. Guess that’s how the Golden Gloves repay his decade worth of loyalty to save our skin & bacon… with his head no less!
I dont like disliking Emiliano as much as I do, but it is what it is. I generally respect guys who’ve worn the shirt… Emi is just plain unlikeable. Two added time goals — one partially with his help and the other wholly with it — couldnt have happened to a nicer guy.
That was sweet. Very sweet. Thank you, Jorginho for giving us the lead. You’ll never see a football more sweetly and expertly struck. Technique, not raw power. 99% of players are putting that 2 miles over the bar. Thank you lads, for fighting and scrapping 2nd half..
Been shouting it loud since the world cup. Emi is a blatant and egregious time waster. His piss taking is next level. We need world cup time adding. 6 minutes were a joke. Dude can easily take 90 secs to take a goal kick. But hey…. thanks dude.
Lots to pick over, but let’s enjoy this stirring comeback.
Well, well. That’s nearly as good a Saturday as we could ask for. Back in the driver’s seat. And Jorghino’s big spending prior team lost again…23 points behind us. Bet he’s not regretting the move and we definitely shouldn’t be either.
I like the player. He’s giving me Arteta (the player) vibes. Not Usain Bolt, but intelligent reader of the game, a dressing room leader and has a shot on him.
Question for Doc… can he and Partey play together, since you’ve advocated the mercy benching of Granit (at least temporarily).
You said it! Couldn’t happen to a “nicer” guy. I’m usually not much for schadenfreude but this time I heartily enjoyed every bit of it, and the ongoing meltdown in south London, and the punchy point Nottingham Forest took off of City with their one shot on target. Wow, you couldn’t script a better weekend for Arsenal.
I think Jorginho and Partey are a great match. They offset each other’s strengths beautifully, much more so than Xhaka-Jorginho. It might be a tad awkward for one of them to play in a more advanced position (it would probably be Partey) because of our single pivot system, but if Granit can do it, either of them certainly can as well.
Partey was a promising winger when he first turned pro, so he has a dribble in him. So it shouldn’t be hard for him to play in the Diaby/Vieira role.
Him and Jorginho pairing up in the middle will let Arsenal try a Invincibles-style 442. Only issue is neither of them are pressers, but holders, so the team just like the Invincibles will switch to a counter-attacking system. Which really isn’t any use against the packed boxes Arsenal faces.
I counted at least 3 unpunished fouls on Saka this match. Plus his ankle had to be strapped during the second half.
He is clearly feeling the impacts and injuries already, and it’s all beginning to feel like early Fabregas/Wilshere. The only consolation is that he is obviously physically more robust and stronger than either of our two previous golden boys. Sorry to say, but he needs to learn to play more cynically.
Josh, points taken, brother. Again, I dont have your coach’s eye, and I respect your POV. I just saw things differently
Watched the game again, and Jorginho’s weight of pass is ridiculous. Right, all the time. Was involved in the Saka goal with a perfectly weighted one to Tomi on the overlap. I though Ode was our pass master, but man…
He’s fit in quickly. On the field, and clearly in the dressing room.
That said he was partially at fault for Coutinho’s goal, in which the overall marking was woeful.
One of Eddie or Xhaka needs to be dropped.
Eddie’s 1st touch reminds of Welbeck. Hampers his overall game.
I think bringing trossard to 8 or 9 position would help our game.
More athletic than Xhaka & technically secure than Eddie.
Xhaka was atrocious yesterday.
Continuing the love for Jorginho, yesterday Vila game he got an absolute cracker strike. Getting to score off Martinez blockhead was absolute top class ( miracle).